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 Trump May Be Right

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1PostSubject: Trump May Be Right   Thu Dec 03, 2015 5:54 pm

I'm beginning to feel that Donald Trump may actually be right on two of the points he's recently tried to make in his campaign speeches, even though I still consider most of his political opinions to be complete garbage. He's said that the USA shouldn't give assylum to ANY adult Muslims who are fleeing the Islamic world, and that the only way to defeat ISIS is to "go after their families". My kneejerk reaction is to say, "Both of these would be completely immoral and the second would violate a number of diferent internatinal laws." However, I have to admit that there is probably truth in the reasons he has given for taking these draconian positions. Namely that if we let in any Islamic refugees except for babies and young children, there's a high probability that some terrorists will slip through, and that the leaders of ISIS can usually avoid being attacked personally, but they'd have little defense against, say, the carpet bombing of the villages where their families and other staunch supporters live.

And leaving the moral arguments aside, the practical reasons against doing both of these that are now being advanced break down when carefully analyzed. I'm sure that if the US stopped accepting any refugees from countries like Syria, the numerous countries who are accepting them would complain, but would they actually do us harm, such as trade boycotts and the like? I doubt it, because all of our dealings with other countries are based on mutual benefit, and they'd be hurting themselves as well. And if we started bombing hell out of the civilian populations in ISIS territory, some or all of the countries that are now engaged in military action against Isis might stop doing so. But since Isis hasn't been defeated with their help, why shouldn't we go ahead and so it on our own. And yes, the US military IS capable of doing the things Trump is advocating.

Now, I'm not endorsing Trump for President, simply because he's completely unqualified for many different reasons, but I may advocate in public postings that Hillary or whoever does end up getting elected follow the policies outlined above. They would be considerably less immoral than GWB's invasion and occupation of Iraq, and if they work, history will vindicate whoever orders them.

So I'd like to see what other readers here think of this.

And I'm wondering if the Reality Check Frog should change his avatar from



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2PostSubject: Re: Trump May Be Right   Mon Apr 18, 2016 6:30 pm

There is no doubt that accepting Yazidis, Christians, Ba'hai's or other minorities that are in grave danger in the Middle East is wiser than accepting Muslims.

Yeah.... I like that new avatar!

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3PostSubject: Re: Trump May Be Right   Mon Apr 18, 2016 8:06 pm

DennisTate wrote:
There is no doubt that accepting Yazidis, Christians, Ba'hai's or other minorities that are in grave danger in the Middle East is wiser than accepting Muslims.

Yeah.... I like that new avatar!


I just put up the new avatar, representing the more militant self-image recent events lead me to believe is appropriate.
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4PostSubject: Re: Trump May Be Right   Wed Jun 08, 2016 6:51 am

Realityrebel wrote:
DennisTate wrote:
There is no doubt that accepting Yazidis, Christians, Ba'hai's or other minorities that are in grave danger in the Middle East is wiser than accepting Muslims.

Yeah.... I like that new avatar!


I just put up the new avatar, representing the more militant self-image recent events lead me to believe is appropriate.

Yes.... an all out LOVE WAR.... has been initiated......

your guides.........
are astonishingly accurate Realityrebel!

What do you think of the opinion of this Florida Rabbi who feels that
perhaps a third or more of Bernie's supporters......
will NOT vote for Hillary......
and some of them may even prefer The Donald.... for all his flaws.....
over her?

http://www.politicalforum.com/latest-us-world-news/456761-rabbi-correct-one-third-bernie-supporters-will-not-vote-hillary.html

Is the Rabbi correct that one third of Bernie supporters will NOT vote for Hillary?
Is Rabbi Shaul Marshall correct that one third of Bernie's supporters WILL NOT vote for Hillary Clinton on November 8?

Mitt Romney lost the election back in 2012 by being too hard on Newt Gingrich so.......
something along that line could perhaps be happening again.

https://www.facebook.com/rabbi.prave...08601930299169

Rabbi Shaul Marshall Praver:
Quote :
"To my beloved family members and friends who support the secretary, I am sorry that the wide spread highly documented election fraud taking place throughout the country nearly always in the secretaries' advantage, may have overwhelmed you and brought about a sort of, "tell me it ain't so," reaction. I understand your silence and denial very well though, because I was once reacting in the same manner.

Please know that I preserve love in my heart for you and I am reserving harsh judgement. I understand the existential pain you, as good people, are attempting to shield yourself from suffering. At the same time I want you to know that a certain assaultive aggression was shown by the Secretaries camp yesterday in Nevada; an assaultive aggression that hints a willingness to exert its rule even with violence. Another layer of the invisibility cloak removed.

I also noticed that according to the rules of the caucus, the press are allowed, but to my knowledge no such coverage took place concerning an open act of election fraud; that such an event is considered unnews worthy and that a condescending "come now lets not be hysterical," is expected to some how be effective in silencing highly intelligent tech savvy people. Tell me, does the absence of the press not trouble you? At some point in time and through some mechanism, the press were instructed by their editors not to write about the Nevada Caucus in any kind of meaningful or qualitative manner. Is this also of no concern to you?

If you were to ask me if I am suggesting that your moral ethical facilities are slumbering, I will save you the time to forthright answer in the affirmative. It is not however, my intention to hurt your feelings, only my intention to try and make you more aware of the copping mechanism you are likely using at this time to avoid deep existential pain; after all, who can rap their head around the idea that we don't have democracy in America and have not had it for quite some time?

Thanks to Senator Sanders who is rapidly removing the invisibility cloak of the oligarchy, many American people are seeing the horrendously grotesque truth for the first time. Others knew this already and they are the ones creating the circumstances wherein the oligarchie's invisibility cloak is being removed layer by layer.

Friends, it is better to suffer the pain now and write yourself into the correct side of ledgers of history. Once the people's eyes have been opened to such a fundamental state of affairs, they cannot be closed again. The little man behind the curtain has been spotted.

Because this is about democracy itself and not any particular candidate, already one third of Senator Sanders supporters will not under any circumstance cast their vote for the secretary. Moreover, I am quite sure given recent events that this number will increase to at least half of the senator's supporters by the time of the convention in Philadelphia this summer. The truth is not going away, the revolution is not going away, it is just more and more revealed and more and more revved up respectively.

At a certain point in time your own conscience will prevail upon you and you will have to make an moral-ethical decision as to whether or not you can continue maintaining denial that will eventually be viewed as complicity with the destruction of America's democracy for generations. It's time, for dear friends and family, to decide where you are spiritually!" (Rabbi Shaul Marshall Praver)
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5PostSubject: Re: Trump May Be Right   Wed Jun 08, 2016 2:08 pm

DennisTate, #4, re: "Yes... an all out LOVE WAR... has been initiated... your guides... are astonishingly accurate Realityrebel!"

I have no idea what you meant by the above. US military forces have contiued to assassinate individual ISIS leaders with drones and the like and to conduct limited bombing of areas believed to be bases for the ISIS forces. So neither the all-out attack the areas where ISIS members and their families are believed to be living that Trump advocated, nor the signifigant scaling down of total US and allied miliatry activity in the area that would constitute "an all out LOVE WAR" have been undertaken. Instead, the status quo has continued, which is what my Guides have been predicting all along ... which is the main reason I didn't post further messages in this thread.

re: "What do you think of the opinion of this Florida Rabbi who feels that perhaps a third or more of Bernie's supporters... will NOT vote for Hillary... and some of them may even prefer The Donald... for all his flaws...over her? [link] Is the Rabbi correct that one third of Bernie supporters will NOT vote for Hillary? Is Rabbi Shaul Marshall correct that one third of Bernie's supporters WILL NOT vote for Hillary Clinton on November 8? Mitt Romney lost the election back in 2012 by being too hard on Newt Gingrich so... something along that line could perhaps be happening again."

After reading your linked pages and the long article excerpt you posted here, I tend to disagree with both of the rabbi's speculations. It's hard for me to imagine anyone who has actually listened to and agreed with Bernie Sanders campaign speeches so far to even consider voting for Donald Trump once they've been exposed to the campaign rhetoric he's going to be preaching from here on in. IMO, most of them will grudgingly vote for Hillary or whoever replaces her as the Democratic candidate if she is forced to drop out, and the rest will either vote Green, cast a write in vote (serious or sarcastic) or not vote for President at all. There are also Republicans or conservative Democrats who have told reporters that they have paid attention to what Sanders has been saying, and like it better than what Hillary has been saying, but I suspect that they'll either support Trump or the Libertarian candidate.

I was active in the on-line phases of the 2012 Presidential campaign all the way through and believe the main reason Obama was elected simply because large numbers of moderates in both major Parties voted for him. Mitt Romney was hard on Newt Gingrich in an effort to appeal to these centrists, but this effort failed.
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6PostSubject: Re: Trump May Be Right   Thu Jun 16, 2016 5:46 pm

Realityrebel wrote:
DennisTate, #4, re: "Yes... an all out LOVE WAR... has been initiated... your guides... are astonishingly accurate Realityrebel!"

Quote :
I have no idea what you meant by the above. US military forces have contiued to assassinate individual ISIS leaders with drones and the like and to conduct limited bombing of areas believed to be bases for the ISIS forces. So neither the all-out attack the areas where ISIS members and their families are believed to be living that Trump advocated, nor the signifigant scaling down of total US and allied miliatry activity in the area that would constitute "an all out LOVE WAR" have been undertaken. Instead, the status quo has continued, which is what my Guides have been predicting all along ... which is the main reason I didn't post further messages in this thread.

re: "What do you think of the opinion of this Florida Rabbi who feels that perhaps a third or more of Bernie's supporters... will NOT vote for Hillary... and some of them may even prefer The Donald... for all his flaws...over her? [link] Is the Rabbi correct that one third of Bernie supporters will NOT vote for Hillary? Is Rabbi Shaul Marshall correct that one third of Bernie's supporters WILL NOT vote for Hillary Clinton on November 8? Mitt Romney lost the election back in 2012 by being too hard on Newt Gingrich so... something along that line could perhaps be happening again."

Quote :
After reading your linked pages and the long article excerpt you posted here, I tend to disagree with both of the rabbi's speculations. It's hard for me to imagine anyone who has actually listened to and agreed with Bernie Sanders campaign speeches so far to even consider voting for Donald Trump once they've been exposed to the campaign rhetoric he's going to be preaching from here on in. IMO, most of them will grudgingly vote for Hillary or whoever replaces her as the Democratic candidate if she is forced to drop out, and the rest will either vote Green, cast a write in vote (serious or sarcastic) or not vote for President at all. There are also Republicans or conservative Democrats who have told reporters that they have paid attention to what Sanders has been saying, and like it better than what Hillary has been saying, but I suspect that they'll either support Trump or the Libertarian candidate.

I was active in the on-line phases of the 2012 Presidential campaign all the way through and believe the main reason Obama was elected simply because large numbers of moderates in both major Parties voted for him. Mitt Romney was hard on Newt Gingrich in an effort to appeal to these centrists, but this effort failed.

Thank you immensely for having a look at this......

now that The Donald has gotten the nomination.....
he is free to reveal his true colors and..... will probably
come out with something that could gain him support from
moderates..........

One way would be specific.... and large numbers..... of LEGAL IMMIGRANTS
from Mexico and South America...........

The government of Mexico is largely controlled by drug lords......
at least that is the impression that I got from the film....."Cartel Land."

http://www.politicalforum.com/current-events/449323-donald-trump-campaign-film-cartel-land.html
The Donald Trump campaign and the film "Cartel Land."
Drug cartels seem to have a great deal of power over the elected officials in Mexico.

If...… The Donald's supporters will view this film and become more well informed a lot of good things could result from this.

For one thing..... this could put pressure on Mexico that results in the release of Dr. Jose Mireles!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cartel_Land
Quote :
Cartel Land is 2015 documentary film directed by Matthew Heineman about the Mexican Drug War, especially vigilante groups fighting Mexican drug cartels. The film focuses on Tim "Nailer" Foley, the leader of Arizona Border Recon, and Dr José Mireles, a Michoacán-based physician who leads the Autodefensas. The film received the 2015 Documentary Film Award from the George Polk Awards in Journalism.[3]
My wife is from Ecuador and I would love to see The Donald come out with a plan to significantly INCREASE LEGAL immigration from Mexico and South America after that wall is built.

This might be a great way to steal much of the thunder that his opponents seem to have at this time?
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7PostSubject: Re: Trump May Be Right   Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:13 pm

Tate, #6, re: "now that The Donald has gotten the nomination... he is free to reveal his true colors and... will probably come out with something that could gain him support from
moderates... One way would be specific... and large numbers... of LEGAL IMMIGRANTS
from Mexico and South America... The government of Mexico is largely controlled by drug lords... at least that is the impression that I got from the film....."Cartel Land." If... The Donald's supporters will view this film and become more well informed a lot of good things could result from this... My wife is from Ecuador and I would love to see The Donald come out with a plan to significantly INCREASE LEGAL immigration from Mexico and South America after that wall is built. This might be a great way to steal much of the thunder that his opponents seem to have at this time?"

I agree that Trump might gain significant support from both Republican politicians and ordinary American voters if he advocated this policy, but it's important to realize that he has no political experience at all and apparently isn't willing listen to advice from people who do. My guess is that he thinks he can get support from moderates by using the same high-pressure sales techniques he's used to get the nomination, and I have no idea what he'll do as Election Day draws nearer and he continues to fall further and further behind Hillary in the polls. But IMO, it doesn't matter, because he's already on videos saying things that will keep him from getting elected no matter what he says from here on in. This is why so many other Republicans are still talking about keeping him from being nominated at the convention, even though this seems to be impossible and it's unlikely they'll actually try.
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